15 replies to this topic

[Oval Racer]

I have an 86 crx si and will do the zc swap (olive top JDM), is there a particular model of 86-88 Integra that is best to get the trans, axels, engine mounts, fuel rail etc ? LS? RS? Obviously a manual trans since my crx is manual. Beyond that I get no more info. I plan to buy the whole Integra and use it as a donor car.

[Hollowman]

The 86-87 Integra has everything you would need to do the "olive top" ZC swap. The RS and LS are mechanically the same so either one would work. PM cbstdscott. Scott can point you in the right direction. Hybrid Honda also has some swap info on their website here Hybrid Honda Swap Info.

Hope this helps!

[Dan-O]

Check the FAQ's at the top of the 1G CRX section. It lists every part you need from the doner 'teg and the pros and cons of which year motor to use.

A ZC is a JDM motor an Integra motor is a D16A1, they are different even though they're are both D series motors. Do a search of this sight, we have been discussiong this exact topic this week in many different threads.
Dan-O

[sspcivic31]

is there a particular model of 86-88 Integra that is best to get the trans, axels, engine mounts, fuel rail etc ? LS? RS?

the ls,rs has same motor&tranny. just a trim level difference. everything else is same. 88-89 has a different 5th gear ratio but theres not a real noticable difference to the 86-87. otherwise tranny same. you need two integra manual mounts(tranny and rear) and the crx/civic engine mount. you need to notch the drivers mount to clear the timing cover on the d16/zc. you can use the crx/civic rear mount(stamped steel) but in my experience it will crack were it attaches to the block and tranny. do yourself a favor and use the teg piece. while the motor is out replace the rubber mount on the crossmember. the crx mount has two studs/the teg has three the are identical otherwise. when you remove the motor you will see waht i'm talking about. you need the front knuckles and hubs and lower arms(the one with the balljoint)from the teg if you use the teg axles. otherwise you need two short crx axles and the integras inner cv joints on the short crx axle's. you can put the integra hubs in the crx knuckles but some machine work to the hub is required. it's easier to swap the whole assembly in my opinion.

[CRXdan]

Which CDM 86-89 Integra came with 4 wheel disc brakes??

[eastsiderider]

didnt all the integras come with 4 wheel disc brakes? when i worked at advance, i would just randomly look up stuff for our cars, and i never found rear drums...........

[CRXdan]

Maybe in the US but im nto so sure about CDM.

[gen1teg]

We didn't get the Integra in Canada until '87. Only the LS models (87-89)came with rear disks (all models in the US did), The Canadian RS had rear drums, black bumpers, seats that were similar to the 1500S, and 13' steel wheels.

[Hollowman]

We didn't get the Integra in Canada until '87.  Only the LS models (87-89)came with rear disks (all models in the US did), The Canadian RS had rear drums, black bumpers, seats that were similar to the 1500S, and 13' steel wheels.

How sad..That seems pretty weak to me..Sorry to hear it..

A ZC is a JDM motor an Integra motor is a D16A1, they are different even though they're are both D series motors. Do a search of this sight, we have been discussiong this exact topic this week in many different threads. Dan-O

Hey Dan the JDM 1st gen ZC (olive top) block and head as well as the tranny are the same as the the USDM 86-87 D16A1 physically so the swap is the same. The differnces are inside the motor (pistons, cams, etc..) and the intake and exhaust manifolds from the US counterparts but are totally interchangable.

The later ZC's from Japan that came with the black valve cover with the bolts along the outside are very different and would not just bolt in like the 1st gen ZC eventhough some parts are interchangeable. This is probably the "ZC" you were referring to.

Edited by Hollowman, 11 December 2003 - 08:32 PM.

[Dan-O]

The later ZC's from Japan that came with the black valve cover with the bolts along the outside are very different and would not just bolt in like the 1st gen ZC eventhough some parts are interchangeable. This is probably the "ZC" you were referring to.

That's exactly what I was talking about.

People throw around the 'ZC' word too often, there is only one ZC twin cam, and it's the JDM one.

The 'teg motor that everyone is talking about is a D16A1.
I was corrected a long time ago about the differnce, so I make it a point to remember.

Now if I could only learn all the D series designations..... Too many D's, too little time...

[Hollowman]

Dan-o I totally know where you are coming from..That ZC thing is just a mess.. "Black top, brown top" yada, yada, yada..When I did the research for my swap about 4 years ago, I fell into the "ZC" trap..The way I try to remember is by the bolt location on the valve cover...I wil PM you a list of D-series Motors and info from a D-series message board..

[Dan-O]

Thanks for the info. (got your PM)
I will read it over tomorrow.

I remembered the one thing that will always give the 'real' ZC guys the bragging rights. Two little letters stamped in the block on the front engine ID area.
The 'teg stuff=D16A1
The JDM Motor=ZC

My buddy has a 'real' ZC. I have a D16A1 (sitting on a stand)

[Hollowman]

I sold my ZC block to a guy on g1teg.org. I couldn't use it for Cali smog. They checked the serial number and it came up as a "Japanese High Performance Engine" so I had to use a D16A1 block just for the serial number to make it legal. But at least I can get my car smogged at any smog station. All of the smog techs look at me funny when I bring it in. I event got pulled over and got to show a cop that it was Smog legal. That felt good!

If you didn't have the link to thid D-Series mesage board here it is: D-Series Message Board

[BlankReg]

folx, i'm glad people have brought up the confusion surrounding ZC and D series engines... i've been trying to sort this out over the last week, and its starting to make my head hurt. if some kind soul could write up all the details about what is a ZC, and whats a D16A1, and which is brown, black, olive, inside bolts, outside bolts, teg, jdm... i'd love to know. that might make a good addition to the new FAQ that tom is testing. or the old FAQ for that matter.

[BlankReg]

for fun, i decided to grab the ZC info out of the faq:

Q: I want to make my car a hybrid and install a bigger, stronger engine. What engine is easy to install in a 1st Gen CRX?
A: The 1986-1989 Integra DOHC D16 engine and transmission will bolt right into a 1st Gen CRX. At the top of the family tree for the D Series, DOHC 1600cc, 16-valve engine is the JDM spec ZC engine of 135 hp. Next in line was the Euro-spec D16A8 which makes about 120 hp. In the US, we got the D16A1 Black Valve Cover version in the 1988-89 Integra, with 118 hp. And at the end of the line is the D16A1 Brown Valve Cover version in the 1986-87 Integra with 113hp.

Many people refer to all 1986-89 Integra engines as being a ZC, but this is not technically correct. ZC is Honda's term for the top rated version of any family of engines. Not many people realize that there was a ZC version of the SOHC D16 engine that was sold in Japan. If you can find all of the JDM parts, you could build a USDM D16 into a ZC. But those parts are rare and probably expensive.

The Brown and Black valve cover version of the DOHC D16 engine are very easy to install. The 88-89 Integra engine (black valve cover) is slightly more powerful than the 86-87 engines (brown valve cover) because it has a better flowing intake manifold, domed pistons with higher compression and lighter connecting rods. The black top D16 has a very different distributor and ECU that will not “just plug-in” to a 1st Gen CRX. You CAN NOT use the brown top distributor on the black top engine.

The BROWN Valve cover is equipped with:
-Flat top pistons
-Thicker rods
-Square styled intake manifold
-Vacuum advance ignition with external coil

The BLACK Valve cover is equipped with:
-Domed pistons
-Slightly lighter rods
-Rounded intake manifold.
-Electronic advance distributor with internal coil.

so the listed differences here are between the 2 versions of the domestic D16A1, correct? does anyone know what is different in the actual jdm ZC engine?

sheesh, if honda uses ZC for all their top of the line engines, how do THEY keep it straight?