Another science project we go...... stock axles for 87 crx si only
Bought car in 93 w 78k. Never pissed on the car other than pulled a small 400 pound trailer for maybe 6000 miles over its lifetime. sometimes hauled rock in excess of 2000 pounds. But was usually 800 pound load. Accelerated gently to take it easy on transmission/driveshaft. Axles are the original oem axles w 259k
rebooted the first time around 100k in 1995 (aftermarket grease/boots)
rebooted 2nd time 162k 3/00 w oem boots grease
rebooted 3rd time 192k 8/04. w oem boots/grease
This sets the usage history of the 259k axles
Next I grouped the 6 sets of used axles and the 259k set, including 2 Honda NOS outer joints i pulled from storage for slop/backlash measurement. The six sets were tossed up in my attic over the past 20 yrs and i didnt do a good job of recording where they came from
Measurements
i measured rotational backlash of each joint. placed axle shaft in vise, used a 11 long channel plier to grab the splines, measured rotational deflection, applied inverse tangent to defection/11 to convert to degrees. Took some careful setup control to ensure i got consistent results. Was repeatable
Below i describe what i know of each shaft set, miles, accident, oem vs rebuilt to best of my knowledge
LABELS:
A) driver outer ,
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
Honda NOS (outer only, inners buried to deep in storage to locate). Outer came attached to shaft
A). .35.
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
1987 crx si #1: 259k axles as described above
A) 1.36
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
Upon removing boots, i could see a lot of movement in the spline mating surfaces of the inner spyder and same for outer joint inner race. id assume the movement made up half of the total slop, if not more
98k 1987 crx si #4. Oem axles/boots/bands - im positive these are original, never rebuilt
A) 1.0
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
car was hit squarely in front. i assume no collision damage
212k 1987 crx si #5. no accident. aftermarket rebuilds since i bought this car pre 2000
A) .68
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
bought this car from a wrecker. died on highway due to bad ignitor.
1987 crx si???. A lister #7?? oem axles/boots/bands. positive original, never rebuilt.
A) 1.47
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
possibly came from alisters #7, or junkyard? i dont remember. mileage not confirmed
129k 1987 crx si #9, Front collision smashed in drivers side hard enough to crack knuckle. drivers shaft was oem w original boots/bands, drivers inner bearings lost. passenger was reman axle. drivers side still on hub. stuck axle nut. cant measure. passenger was rebuilt, assume very low miles
A) na
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
150k 1986 crx si pair of reman/aftermarket shafts pulled from random junkyard. both axles reman from rockford, hurst, tx. passenger spindle nut stuck, cant messure yet
A) 1.99
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
ARI remanufactured passenger axle purchased new, unused sitting in box
A) na.
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
a random drivers shaft. oem inner boot w aftermarket outer boot. no idea
A) 1.34.
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
1987 crx si??? drivers side oem boots/bands. passenger rockford reman
A) didnt messure, i whacked off the joint.
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
Im using the NOS outer joint as my new baseline. Since i didnt have time to pull the nos inners, im just going to assume they are the same and multiply by 2 for total new backlash from honda nos half shaft. so i assume oem honda backlash is .35 + .35 = .7 degrees of backlash per half shaft. BASELINE .7 degrees
my goal of science project was to return my axles to as near new using original honda oe joints/boots/bands/shafts/grease. i cherry picked the best of above to rebuild a new set for my 259k beater.
PASSENGER: i used the 98k #4 oem passengershaft/joints/bands as is. repacked w honda grease/nok boots.
DRIVER: i used one of my nos drivers shaft/outer joint sets. i used the inner joint tulip from my passenger 259k shaft bc it was in awesome condition. but swapped to other side of drivetrain so itll run on reverse side. this 259k tulips inner grooves were perfect. i couldnt detect any wear as a ran my finger along the groove. but the oem spider was very loose on the splines after 259k miles. so i grabbed a good\tight spyder / bearings from an oem shaft w/ .76 degrees. assembled the new drivers shaft
my new rebuilt shaft w honda parts
A) .35
![B)](https://www.redpepperracing.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/cool.png)
This reduces the drivers shaft slop from 2.83 to .92 degrees. Assuming a new shaft is .7, thats only 31% over new
reduces the passenger shaft slop from 2.30 to 1.17 degrees. assuming a new shaft is .7, that 67% over new.
put about 500 miles on my self rebuilt axles. Work great. no vibrations. i can feel the reduction is axle slop as i change gears. Feels more responsive
What Ive learned....
1) The inner joints are the same p/n 44310-sa5-300 as the 83-87 prelude and 81-85 accord. Both these cars have larger engines so i assume out little civics and crx inner joints dont wear out bc they are designed for heavier cars w larger motors = good for us. explains why my 259k inners looked really good.
2) new honda shafts DO have backlash from factory. many post that axles should be tight. I believe reman axles are too tight since they use oversized balls w reground races stuffed together. and reman breaks in and slop loosens in the first 1000 miles???
3) Many claim better to use rebuilt axles w genuine honda shafts w the 2 red stripes for best fit and no vibration
4) i opened 2 remanned inner joints, examined the bearings and races. obvious they ground out the previous wear and installed oversized roller bearings, reversed driver to passenger side to even wear. the larger bearings were .005 larger. probably not a balance/vibration problem?
5). Play musical parts w your own cores to rebuild your own
6) since honda grease still available, use it for long life. i got 259k out of my joints and they still werent clicking. my clicking appears to be differential bearings from hauling trailer.
7) i tried using metal stamps to mark my joint s. honda does a great job w heat treat. i had to pound hard just to make a faint mark on the joint. curious to make my own rockwell drop slide. could compare hardness between aftermarket and oem
8) baseline measure joints for backlash when rebooting. then you can track wear
9) remanufacturers dont like to rebuild a core twice per industry standard A second round of grinding and oversized bearings removes too much of the hardened metal on the races = quick failure. saw an article about not removing more than .010 of hardened race metal. so if a core gets ground/rebuilt twice, its going to fail faster
10) early 2000s when new chinese axles came to market. beginning of reman decline
11) called a dallas rockford shop to ask about rebuild 80s axles. he said hes out of parts
12) called rockford corporate. they stopped making rebuild kits 15 yrs ago due to cheap chinesesxle cost and parts stores dont want to deal w cores
13) tracking my oem boots for longevity. most of my stock is 15-20yrs old. at some point aftermarket boots will out perform due to age
14) appears 50% of slop comes from the spline connection. id swap spiders on shafts. appears slop followed the spiders.
15). i cant tell how much backlash will will cause clicking. dont know if my other axles click
My old 259k oe shafts could have kept going in service - no clicking, just a lot of backlash. car drives so much better on shifting. im confident my self rebuilds will last another 150-200k, w a few boot changes of course. Happy to keep my japanese metal/rubber/grease.
Probably the best info in this for you is to know the backlash of a new honda axle. knowing what the degradation in backlash after 259k on a working axle. then you can decide when your axle is really worn out. or the backlash becomes too much for your taste
if youve read all of this, more power to you. i have 4 other crxs to work on. thats the reason for going to this level. now i can cookie cut the process for the others
investigating sourcing outer replacement joints from ashika, triscan, etc...have some on order. keep you posted