407 replies to this topic

[firstgencrx]

NOTE: Due to an unforseen problem with my crappy IP provider, most of the images in this thread have been lost. I am going to try and rebuild the ones for the installation of the plates. Sorry for the troubles.

David


Hello all,

Welcome to my first build thread. I know most people post the progress of their car projects in this location, but I am going to post the progress of building 5 adjustable caster/camber plates of my own design. You will get to see all of my secrets and my mistakes!! So be nice to me.

I have worked very hard on the design and I am sure some of you will like it as much as I do. What I will be building is the third iteration of this design.

If you are more interested about this project in general, and would like to get a hold of one of these sets when they are done, cruise over to my formal post in the “General” section of the list.



So let's get started:

DAY 1: This is what 25 adjustable caster/camber plates look like BEFORE anything is machined!



Hopefully when I am finished they will resemble something like the earlier prototype shown on the table as well.

I will start to machine the discs on the lathe tomorrow.

David

EDIT: Installation instructions start on page 13.

Edited by firstgencrx, 15 August 2009 - 02:48 PM.

[jsgprod]

^^^ Literally, that's what I just did when I saw all that aluminum on your table David!

You definitely have some work ahead of you. I'd really like to tell you to keep me in mind when you get them done but I need to check some of the clearances around my shock towers first. Those would at least give me some adjustment in caster, I currently have none.

Jay

[firstgencrx]

^^^ Literally, that's what I just did when I saw all that aluminum on your table David!

You definitely have some work ahead of you. I'd really like to tell you to keep me in mind when you get them done but I need to check some of the clearances around my shock towers first. Those would at least give me some adjustment in caster, I currently have none.

Jay

Jay,

These plates work with a stock tower. No mods needed to the top of the tower except the addition of one small 6mm hole if you want to take advantage of the third mounting point. Even that extra hole is not needed if you choose. Follow the build thread and you will see what I mean. They even clear a windshield wiper motor with the cover on!

David

[firstgencrx]

Day 2: Caster/Camber Plate Build

************************************
First I have a really stupid question. Can someone please tell me how to change the title discription message in my post when I reply to it? I want to be able to say something new about what I am doing as I progress along in this thread. I noticed others do this, but I can't figure it out!
************************************

The day was good. I did not get as much done as I had hoped, but progress was made! I spent the second half of the day turning parts on my lathe. For the machinists in the group, you will be bored, but for the curious, read on.

The lathe I own is an old Hendy. It was built in about 1939. First purchased by the US Navy, it served early life in the belly of an aircraft carrier during world war II. It swings about 12 inches with 54 inches between centers. It is about 10 feet long and weighs about 5000 pounds! They do not make them like this anymore.



After picking out enough discs from my pile for 5 sets, plus a few chasers (chasers are spares that follow the process in case I make a mistake), I debured them and then proceeded to fit them to a set of soft jaws. Soft jaws are aluminum jaws for the chuck that can be machined to fit the parts you are making. Soft jaws provide a very high degree of repeatability for very accurate parts.



Finished machined jaws.



With the parts ready for the lathe, I first pilot dril them with a 1/4 inch cobalt, split point stub drill. Split point stubs are stiffer because of their short length (do not wander as much) and cut faster than the standard jobber drills because of the agressive geometry ground on the ends.



After the drilling, I face off the first side and dust off the outside diameter of the disc.





I managed to get all the discs surfaced on one side and the edges turned today. I also started drilling out some of the centers of the discs and facing off the back sides. Tomorrow, I should finish all of the lathe work for the main discs. This first five sets of caster/camber plates are well on their way!!



Take care,

David

Edited by firstgencrx, 27 June 2007 - 11:20 PM.

[strudel]

First I have a really stupid question. Can someone please tell me how to change the title discription message in my post when I reply to it? I want to be able to say something new about what I am doing as I progress along in this thread. I noticed others do this, but I can't figure it out!

I think you have to be a contributing member to be able to change the title. Just do your first donation in advance and you should be on your way. JS

Just did a check on one of my threads. Go to one of your posts and select EDIT at the bottom of it and then select the "Full Edit Tab" Then you can change the Topic and Title info. Again, you may only be able to do this if you are a contributing member, I'm not sure, since I am, I can! JS

Oh, I will be the first to ask the stupid question as I have never worked on a metal lathe. How is the disc held tight in the soft jaws so that it doesn't move? Just a snug fit or otherwise? JS

[firstgencrx]

I think you have to be a contributing member to be able to change the title. Just do your first donation in advance and you should be on your way. JS

Just did a check on one of my threads. Go to one of your posts and select EDIT at the bottom of it and then select the "Full Edit Tab" Then you can change the Topic and Title info. Again, you may only be able to do this if you are a contributing member, I'm not sure, since I am, I can! JS

Oh, I will be the first to ask the stupid question as I have never worked on a metal lathe. How is the disc held tight in the soft jaws so that it doesn't move? Just a snug fit or otherwise? JS

Thanks for the tip. I will drop some money into the kitty in advance tomorrow.

As far as the lathe soft jaws, if you look at the third image in the "Day 2" post, you will see that I cut into the jaws a depth of about a 100 thou. This is more than enough to hold the disc snug if you do not tighten it too much. You could grab the disc with less of a bite, say 50 thou or so, but it would be more dangerous. Besides, I still want to keep all of my teeth.

Ask away!

David

[strudel]

As far as the lathe soft jaws, if you look at the third image in the "Day 2" post, you will see that I cut into the jaws a depth of about a 100 thou. This is more than enough to hold the disc snug if you do not tighten it too much. You could grab the disc with less of a bite, say 50 thou or so, but it would be more dangerous. Besides, I still want to keep all of my teeth

I did notice that. So I take it there is a mechanism on the lathe that pushes(pressures) the 3 jaws in towards the middle. That would make sense. Thanks. JS

[firstgencrx]

Day 3:

Not much to show because I spent most of the afternoon and evening trying to finish what I started yesterday. Almost finished the lathe work on the top and bottom discs! The bottom disc lathe work is done. The tops need to be final bored. A couple more hours on the lathe and it's off the the milling machine.



The bottom of the bottom disc. That sounds funny.


Tomorrow I will finish the lathe work on the top discs and make some jigs to hold the bottom discs to the rotory table. I will then start putting all the holes into the bottom discs. This is the part where I cry like a baby because I do not own a CNC.

LOTS OF WORK!

Take care,

David

[firstgencrx]

Day 4:

Today I finished up the lathe work on the top dics. Whew! I was getting bored with lathe work.



Then the UPS man came with gifts. Pillow Bearings!! 50 of them.



I spent the better part of the afternoon on the milling machine making a special jig to hold the bottom discs for drilling. It mounts up to a small 6" rotory table I have. Perfect size for these parts. Took me longer than I thought it would, but the time was well spent. I plan on making lots of these caster/camber plates. I didn't get started drilling the bottom discs untill the late evening. Here is what the jig looks like, sort of a bad picture:



Tomorrow I drill, drill, drill. Well actually it is more like, put drill in chuck, drill. Swap out drill for tap in chuck, tap. Turn crank on rotory table 15 degrees. Repeat. Yea repeat, almost 300 times! This is where I cry for a CNC.

Take care,

David

[firstgencrx]

Day 5:

Today was a great day! I got all the bottom discs machined. Here is a picture of one moments before it comes out of the jig:



Here are the bottom discs finished minus deburing. Deburing is more work than you would think, but I am glad the stress of this is done. Without a CNC on something like this, you are constantly sweating making a mistake!





I tried one of the new plates (even before deburing) an a shock tower, and it fits perfectly!



Some have asked me about the third mounting location. You can see the third mounting location in these next two pictures. This location is optional, but I recommend using it if you have a hand drill and you are reasonably handy with it.





Well, I am tired. Tomorrow I am taking the day off. My next post of progress on the plates will be on Monday.

Have a great Sunday everyone!!!

David

[strudel]

David,
Obviously this is the bottom plate showing the bottom side up as you don't see the four cutouts when it is on the shock tower. Could you explain to this layman what the cutouts are for?

Nevermind, I did the smart thing and went and looked on the car and found the dimples on the tower that they are made for.

But, that bodes another question or two. Are the units a R and L version or interchangeable, I suspect the latter. With your future addition of a strut bar, same question. Just my curiosity here.

Once these are mounted two small issues crop up and I wonder if you have engineered them into the units. On each strut tower is a mounting screw hole for the resistor box on the drivers side and the main fuse box on the passenger side. Will we have to re-orientate those on our own or have you built in a special bolt mount hole for them?

Since I hve no black box on drivers side not an issue for me. The passenger side is a cramped area as that is where my intake for the K&N filter runs, same as for many others. May be worth building this in as a bonus for a sales pitch. Don't wish to give you more work but may make it more appealable to some people when they have to make a choice. JS

[Airgazm86]

Just out of curiosity, do you have to individually measure and punch each hole to be drilled? Or do you simply use adjustments on your equipment that help keep everything exact?

Either way, that's a lot of drilling!

[firstgencrx]

But, that bodes another question or two. Are the units a R and L version or interchangeable, I suspect the latter. With your future addition of a strut bar, same question. Just my curiosity here.

The plates are made to fit on either side.

The strut bar I am working on will fit under the plates where it connects to the tower. Strut bars are controversial on these cars because of the little good they do. The bar I am designing is very stiff and borrows on ideas I got from the very famous and infamous kakabox project. My bar will span across in front of the injector manifold and connect to the firewall as well. I am prepared for it to be recieved with some people loving it and some hating it. But regardless of what people think, it will do its job without question. I hate it when someone comes out with a component that claims to improve the handling of your car, but upon closer inspection, you can clearly see it doesn't do shit.

Once these are mounted two small issues crop up and I wonder if you have engineered them into the units. On each strut tower is a mounting screw hole for the resistor box on the drivers side and the main fuse box on the passenger side. Will we have to re-orientate those on our own or have you built in a special bolt mount hole for them?

No, you will have to relocate the fuse box and the resistor box. A simple hole near by and a modist mod to the bracket should do it. I did think about all of this and am considering some kind of special bracket to do that, but because I have seen others move these components with ease, I did not think it would be an issue. I will work on the idea after my first run if you like.

Take care,

David

[strudel]

Thanks for the answers. No surprise in what you said.

The strut bar I am working on will fit under the plates where it connects to the tower. Strut bars are controversial on these cars because of the little good they do. The bar I am designing is very stiff and borrows on ideas I got from the very famous and infamous kakabox project. My bar will span across in front of the injector manifold and connect to the firewall as well. I am prepared for it to be recieved with some people loving it and some hating it.

This is also good news. Keep up the good work. JS

[kakabox]

...ideas I got from the very famous and infamous kakabox project.

"Infamous"? Huh?