29 replies to this topic

[86 Civic SI]

I'm going to replace the Keihin with either a Holley 5200 or a Weber 32/36. Can someone who has set up/tuned one share some knowlegde of jet sizes,...etc. for
a stock motor and exhaust. I am not really looking for performance just a good daily econo ride.
Thanks for any replies.

[86 Civic SI]

I just bought a new Holley 5200 meant for a Ford Pinto 2.0 litre motor with Redline adaptor. Do you think it
will work fine w/o any jet mods? Any knowledge/info here is appreciated...Thanks...

[1stGenRex]

I just bought a new Holley 5200 meant for a Ford Pinto 2.0 litre motor with Redline adaptor.  Do you think it
will work fine w/o any jet mods?  Any knowledge/info here is appreciated...Thanks...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

you are goin to need to tune it. I know someone had one of these, i just dont recall who would be a good source of info.

[87CivicDXguy]

you are goin to need to tune it. I know someone had one of these, i just dont recall who would be a good source of info.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I just recently installed a Weber DGAV (converted to electric choke so technically it's actually like a DGEV) in my '87 Civic DX and have been searching for quite awhile already trying to find someone with a similar setup who can share jetting info. I've got an '86 CRX EW1 motor in mine with a 16 valve head flowing through stock intake and exhaust manifolds. Odometer shows 230,000 and I think it still had the original catalytic converter on it which must have been about 80% clogged! Before I gutted it, it sounded like it still had a muffler on it when it was running straight-piped and got probably 3 times louder afterwards! Lots less restriction there now! Unfortunately I've got the not so cool Hondamatic tranny on mine yet but don't plan on doing a manual swap on it until this one's toast...

I know there's another guy on here somewhere with a 32/36 on his 3rd Gen. Civic too who has posted a lot of info on carbs but I can tell you that even with incorrect jetting, the 32/36 downdraft Weber (or Holley) is a HUGE improvement over the stock unit in terms of reliability and performance. Mine even idled perfectly when hot or cold for the first time since I bought the car! I know that the stock setup is plagued with problems there! The biggest benefit (aside from looking and running better) is that you can gain about 10-15 ponies by totally eliminating all the emissions boxes, sensors, charcoal canister and in all, about 30 pounds of that spaghetti nightmare! (If you don't have to pass emissions tests!) ;)

I've heard of some people complaining of fuel starvation when cornering hard but I haven't had any problems with that at all... I just need to get mine dialed in a little better. I've heard that the Webers are generally more efficient than the stock ones (Hitachi's, I think... stamps on carb are in japanese!) but I guess we'll see once mine's running right! I'm surprised that some guys are actually ditching their fuel injection and going to carbs but I've always stood by the keep it simple theory... the more stuff you've got, the more that can go wrong but at least with carbs you're not limited by a computer hooked to loads of sensors!

There seems to be a pretty noticable flat spot just before the secondary starts to open and it will falter until you get on it harder and then it's got all kinds of strong acceleration until you put it down all the way when it again seems to slump. Off the line and around town it's real decent and driveable up to about 50mph but on the highway, it's difficult to maintain a steady speed (it'll bog) without constantly accelerating and slowing down and so on. I've generally been running the automatic in 3rd gear up to 65 or 70 before even putting it in 4th due to this problem. The Civic's overdrive gear ratio is not real useful at speeds less than 65 and is not to my liking at all! I'd just be happy to get that carb dialed-in though! Right now it's got 170/160 jets and 140/140 in the bowl and 50/60 air jets so what next? Try a 165 on the secondary maybe? I may have to buy an air/fuel gauge to figure out what's going on with it but I think it would still be difficult to pinpoint where to start. Oh, and I've replaced the mechanical fuel pump on the camshaft and the fuel filters too so I know it's not either of them causing a problem. This is my first post here and I really hope someone's able help me out with this!

[Surestick]

It takes Weber 32/36 DGV jets right?
Redline-Weber sells a conversion so they should know the jetting.

[vaughan]

have you cut your intake manifold so the cvcc port is getting more fuel

[Omega Mugen]

There seems to be a pretty noticable flat spot just before the secondary starts to open and it will falter until you get on it harder...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You need a bigger secondary idle jet. I had the same problem.

[87CivicDXguy]

You need a bigger secondary idle jet.  I had the same problem.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for the advice... so how much bigger of a secondary idle jet should I go with? What are you running on yours? With the redline baseplate adapter I shouldn't really need to trim out that CVCC port should I?

I got my Weber 32/36 off an '84 Civic at the local salvage yard and was hoping it would be jetted correctly already... I hooked everything up exactly the same way this car's previous owner did but I'm now questioning the vacuum advance ports on the distributor. I'm currently only using only one of them (like the JYD did) but am starting to think that maybe manifold vacuum should be hooked up to the other just like on some of the older Toyota's to compensate for any dip in vacuum from the carb. I really think a lot of the driveability issues I'm having may be timing related besides having a jetting issue as well. Tension on the timing belt was quite loose and performance was improved by adjusting that as well but I may just weld the weights on the dizzy @ full advance like some other guy recommended. I've also heard that you can advance the distributor to full lock on these 1.5's for some more HP. I tried it briefly but it seemed to lose a little bottom end power on take off but didn't notice much in the top end though. I don't want to run into any pre-detonation issues or anything but for a cheap mod, it may be worth a try. What are your thoughts on all this?

[Omega Mugen]

Thanks for the advice... so how much bigger of a secondary idle jet should I go with?  What are you running on yours?  With the redline baseplate adapter I shouldn't really need to trim out that CVCC port should I?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have a 75 secondary idle, one of the biggest available. I think they only go to 90 or something. I went up to an 85 and got a rich bog. I think it helps to feed the CVCC part of the manifold because it is extra valve area with the CVCC valves, but you should be able to run with it completely blocked. I don't know how this affects the breathablility of the head with the squish and quench zones and all that stuff.

Now that I think about your problem a little more though, it may be that your secondary idle is too big. I had to go up and up and up on the secondary idle that makes me think you're too lean though. Your bog may also be due to the secondary emulsion tube. I got best results with a secondary e-tube with very few holes on the bottom and a lot of holes on the top. To complicate the issue, I get monster top end with no holes on the bottom part (F59) of the primary e-tube, but the progression is not smooth, so I use the F59 tube for racing and switch to one with two small holes on the lower part for daily driving. Tuning a progessive carb is complicated having four circuits operating in sequence. Have patience.

As for the distributor, I haven't a clue abotu the weights, but I run the yellow banded hose from the distributer to the vacuum port on the carb and have the other hose plugged. It works fine as far as I know.

Edited by Omega Mugen, 19 September 2006 - 07:25 PM.

[vaughan]

i had the same setup on mine before i went with the si head. and i have a couple questions two. maybe omegan can help with. this is what i ran into may spark plugs color was white with just the redline adapter plate. i cut the cvcc port. and it started smoken bad. i thougt maybe something got through and took out a ring or something. i tore i down and decoverd it was just burning off all the excess carbon from running rich. so im think i had to run it really rich to get enough fuel in the cyclinder to get to the spark plug for combuston. that is why i recomended opening up the cvcc port. but the question being how can you really properly tune a dx head.my guess would be th read the spark plug color and a gas annilizer. simply because you have fuel going to the spark plug and fuel going to the cyclinder. and just from my experence just because the plug is white didn't mean i was running lean. just something ive wondered about

[ibcnya]

I'm going to replace the Keihin with either a Holley 5200 or a Weber 32/36.  Can someone who has set up/tuned one share some knowlegde of jet sizes,...etc. for
a stock motor and exhaust.  I am not really looking for performance just a good daily econo ride.
      Thanks for any replies.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey one more for NC I dont know nothing about carbs....barely know about the fuel injection

[Omega Mugen]

my guess would be th read the spark plug color and a gas annilizer.  simply because you have fuel going to the spark plug and fuel going to the cyclinder. and just from my experence just because the plug is white didn't mean i was running lean. just something ive wondered about

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't read the plugs. I read that it's not accurate. I use a wideband O2 sensor. You can get away without one if you know how rich feels and how lean feels. The motor reacts differently.

[vaughan]

i have a nerrow band it is kind of a pos butt it tells me if the stumbells are lean or rich

[86 Civic SI]

I went ahead and installed the Holley 5200 and it runs ok but seems alot slower and less responsive than the stock carb(when it ran well) so I am thinking it is running a bit rich. I also need to look into the timing as well as another post suggests. I purchased a Holley jet kit and will play around with things and post back...nice to have a car that idles smooth at low rpm's again!

[wymdawg]

redline webber's sight has pretty good (and free) info about carb tuning\jet sizing if you havent seen it ,it may be worth a look. pretty simple guide for there carbs but may help