314 replies to this topic

[PuddleSkipper]

Here is the HASPORT Clutch Master Cylinder Adapter with my new clutch master cylinder. I am planning on welding it to the bracket on the transmission that the ground bolts to. This locates the clutch cable close to the stock position of the former EW4.

Here is the P20 with the bracket the ground bolts to, don't mind the extremely bright orange air hose, I have no room!

Here is a better close up of the bracket itself that I am welding the HASPORT Clutch Master Cylinder Adapter to.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 15 December 2011 - 10:27 PM.

[PuddleSkipper]

Here is a pic of the designated hole in the firewall for the throttle body cable. I know for certain that this is the same hole on the 84-87, 88-91, and 92-95 civics, possibly even up into the 2000s. Does anybody know if Honda switched to "fly by wire" TBs yet where there is no throttle cable? If they did what year was it? I know that many car manufacturers have and I think the fly by wire pedal was what was blamed for the run away Prius in California that wouldn't stop.

Here are three comparisons of an 88-91 throttle cable vs the 84-87 throttle cable:

If you look closely at this pic it shows the part that secures the throttle cable to the firewall, notice how similar they are? This makes them interchangable. When inserted into the firewall it is given a 1/4 turn which locks it in place. On the left is a 91 Civic EX throttle cable (for my future MPFI swap on my wifes 89 civic), on the right is the cable from my 87 Civic Si.


Although the part that plugs into the firewall is similar, the end that attaches to the accelerator pedal is different. I plan on driving my car a lot and like the idea of using newer parts from newer cars because it makes it easier to find the parts when I need them. Moving forward with this thought I plan on using a throttle cable from 88 and up MPFI civics. As shown in the next pic, the ends between the 84-87 and the 88-91 civic throttle cables are different. This means I am probably going to borrow a gas pedal from an 88-91 civic so that I can use the 88 on up MPFI throttle cables. The 92-95 throttle cables are pretty much the same as the 91 EX cable depicted in the example. Besides having the same ends on both the pedal side and the throttle body side, they also have similar lengths. 88-91 Civic LX/DX also have the same ends but are much, much longer because they were made for the DPFI set up and not the MPFI set up like the SI and EX cables were. This may also be true if you decide to use an 84-87 carb throttle cable but you need to check it yourself. Believe it or not I have actually seen and 88-91 civic at the junkyard with an MPFI swap using the DPFI cable. Besides looking ridiculous I would be afraid of binding, especially at the wrong time (Binding can lead to sticky/stuck cable). Maybe I am making more of it that what is is but I would never use the DPFI throttle cable on an MPFI set up. However, SI and EX cables are hard to find at the junkyard so I plan on snagging a 92-95 civic throttle cable because availibility.


This pic just shows that the throttle body ends of the throttle cables are pretty much the same. (91 EX cable top, 87 SI cable bottom)


So just to repeat myself if it wasn't clear, 84-87 Civic pedal assembly, swap in 88-91 civic accelerator pedal, and use a 92-95 throttle cable.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 15 December 2011 - 11:32 PM.

[Screech]

I know the 99 CR-V LX auto accel cable has the same connector at the pedal as the 86 Civic Si, but is way long unless you plan to wrap it around the top of the engine and back to the throttle body from the passenger side. But the 97-98 CR-V had a different intake manifold, as a result it may have had a more direct route to the throttle body. I'm sure there is a member here with a 97-98 CR-V that could pop their hood and get the answer and maybe even a pic.

You could get an 87 Integra Auto with cruise pedal assembly. The accel pedal on that has the same style as that 91 EX, But you will have to move the accel pedal to the Civic pedal assembly and you may need to drill new holes for it in the Civic, would have to measure from the pivot pin to the cable mount point. I know that the Civic and Integra units have the hole for of the pivot pin offset about the diameter of the hole. Since you can weld it may be easiest to just chop the tops off of both pedals and weld the other top on the Civic's pedal.

You can see how long the 99 CR-V cable is in this pic.

[PuddleSkipper]

Awesome! Thanks for your imput Screech, didn't know about the different lengths from the pivot point to the cable mount, and thanks for pointing out the stuff about the CRV. I probably will just do like you said and use the 87 Integra Auto pedal, that leaves open the opportunity for cruise control down the road. Probably wont do cruise control just yet, especially due to my inexperience in wiring, but I don't ever plan on getting rid of this car so I am sure a rebuild in the future is in order, what that entails I don't know but another thing to cross my mind was anti-lock brakes would be a really cool thing to have

[Screech]

Cruise requires more than just the pedal. You'll have to drill all of the spot welds for the backing plates of the Integra and Civic pedal assemblies and swap the Integra unit that has the cruise lever on it that engages the tab on the Integra accel pedal. Click me to see the hybrid pedal assembly.

[PuddleSkipper]

Cruise requires more than just the pedal. You'll have to drill all of the spot welds for the backing plates of the Integra and Civic pedal assemblies and swap the Integra unit that has the cruise lever on it that engages the tab on the Integra accel pedal. Click me to see the hybrid pedal assembly.

I checked out your pic and the backing plate is the piece with the four holes in it that the studs for the brake booster bolt through right? The part against the firewall? So if I am repeating you right, for what I am doing, I need an 87 Integra Auto with cruise pedal assembly, I hack off the top part of the 87 Integra gas pedal to weld to my 87 SI pedal to use the throttle cable that I want to use and I also need the backing plate which will provide me with the cruise lever, setting me up down the road for cruise control? How long did this take you, an afternoon? Just wondering about the time, I am having trouble budgeting time to this project, and need to be on the road soon, but I do realize the more time I take now the happier I will be later. Thanks again for your imput.

[PuddleSkipper]

eh..........I am sure I can figure it out, my "shop" is 45 min from my apt so I can't just drive there to compare your assembly with my stock version. Maybe I will snap a pic tommorrow and post for comparison. I think I'll stick to the original plan, a simple D series swap sticking to the bare essentials, quick and dirty. Would like to get into that other stuff but later down the road. I absolutely love your swap Screech, but that's your style, and I don't have that kinda timeline and I own an LX which means I am familiar with some of the extra gadgetry and the problems that ensue when they don't work (especially when your only source for replacement comes from the junkyard). The focus of my build is fuel economy and low maintenance. I am looking forward to your D series build though and am curious if your going to do OBD2 again or what OBD platform your going to use. I have read through your blog on your server, haven't read through all the stuff on RPR but was thinking that the 88-91 power mirrors were pretty close in looks and dimensions to the 84-87, but then again maybe you already knew that and currently have them installed on your sweet ride. Thanks again, and feel free to chime in again, especially if I am giving wrong info.

[PuddleSkipper]

Here are pics of the 84-87 Pedal Assembly to compare to Screech's hybrid pedal setup.

Couple pics of front side of pedals



Couple pics of bottom side of pedals



Couple pics of back side of pedals (Backing Plate)

The dark blue spots are places where the bracket (the one the pedals are bolted through) are spotwelded to the backing plate that Screech drilled out to use the integra backing plate. If your interested in cruise control I would send your questions his way. I am just posting my pics for comparison.


I am sticking to the 88-91 pedal, for me this will take less time and get me on the road quicker, There are two civics at the junkyard that I have already ripped out the dash on, I think it is 6 bolts or nuts I have to turn to get them off and it's mine.

[PuddleSkipper]

Here are some comparisons of the D15Z1 TB/Intake (on Left) vs JDM D15  VTEC-E (Same fuel economy as D15Z1) TB/Intake (on Right)

The JDM D15 VTEC-E's TB is definitely bigger and I believe was the same bore size as the D16A6 TB (measured the same anyway on my Harbor Freight caliper).




Here is a pic of the intake, the JDM intake looks longer and possibly thicker in the plenum as well



Here is a pic of the intake manifold ports, as you can also see the JDM D15 VTEC-E's ports are bigger than the D15Z1 (on Left) as well.


According to another recent post I read on here the JDM D15 is supposed to have 5 hp more than the D15Z6. So if you really want to do a D15Z1 gas mileage swap, I am guessing it is best to stick with USDM motors, probably have to rebuild one.

 

03/05/13 - I recently discovered that the JDM D15B  VTEC-E, which is what my motor is, is essentially the same as a D15Z1 with the same fuel economy. It is marked by D15B on the block but carries the  "VTEC-E" on the valve cover, the E behind VTEC stands for Economy, which is how it is identified. This is the same valve cover found on all D15Z1's. Funny, although it has a bigger intake it still carries a 92 hp rating.

 

Edit 1/21/14: Found this on Honda Swap and added some additional info

 

Honda Throttle Body Sizing Chart

 

Inside Diameters (in mm)

d15b6 - 41

d15b2 - 41

d15z1 - 41

d15b7 - 56

d16a6 - 55

d16y7 - 56

d16y8 - 56

d16z6 - 56

ZC - 55

d16a1 - 55

d16a8 - 55

b18c1 - 60

b18c5 - 62

b18a - 58

b18b - 60

b16a SiR - 58

b16a Sir2 - 60

b16a2 - 60

b16a3 - 60

b20b - 60

b20z - 60

h22a - 60

h23a - 60

f20c - 62

f22 - 60

f23 - 60

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 21 January 2014 - 09:15 PM.

[King D]

Nice project. I have Z1 swap in my EG hatch... very good little motors with LONG gears. Care to part with the USDM VX intake manifold???

[PuddleSkipper]

Nice project. I have Z1 swap in my EG hatch... very good little motors with LONG gears. Care to part with the USDM VX intake manifold???

Just the manifold or are you talking the whole thing? I do have many spare parts, I'll just pm you.

[PuddleSkipper]

Did the valve cover gasket and the oil pan gasket on Monday. For some reason I have always had problems with the oil pan gasket. I guess we'll see if it leaks later. Need to clean up the intake and the exhaust gasket areas on the block on Sat. I am also planning on painting the Hasport mounts black. I am planning on reusing the JDM intake, I don't want to choke my motor by air restriction, and comparing it to the stock D15Z1 it definitely has larger passages. Going off the info on crxmpg.com, where a lot of my ideas and information came for this swap, that guy assumed that he was getting a JDM D15Z1, which I now know that there is no such thing. So according to his site, despite actually running a 130 hp JDM Vtec D15, he is still pulling good mpg numbers. Thank you also to King D for the suggestion on the NPT plugs for the EGR passages. According to someone I bought some parts from, they said that the EGR holes were soldered shut but King D told me they were actually fitted aluminum plugs that were welded in place and as I mess with the manifold that is becoming more evident. Using NPT plugs means I can easily access the EGR passages for cleaning/inspection anytime I want instead of it being a massive grinding/drilling/welding project. I need to strip the intake and run it to the machine shop to get it milled for the EGR passage plugs and the Air purge valve. The JDM intake is missing the air purge valve so it needs machined for the screw to mount the air purge and the vacuum port that sticks out of the manifold. I could do it differently, as the guy in crxmpg.com did by just zip tying it somewhere and just using a vacuum tee to tie it in to the manifold but that would bother me. To each his own and might as well take care of it while the intake is off.
Heres info on cleaning the EGR passages:
How to clean you EGR Ports on 88-91 Crx HF

Here's pics I pulled from the same page in the comments.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 06 January 2012 - 05:55 PM.

[PuddleSkipper]

The direction I am going with this car share many characteristics with the CRX HF. I plan on using a highly efficient gas mileage motor (kinda true). But I also plan on doing a weight reduction. This is what made the CRX HF's great race cars later on, both 1G and 2Gs. I am hoping that while I enjoy great gas mileage when this is completed that I might race the car later. In the works I am hoping to install either a fiberglass or carbon fiber hood, but I need your help. These are not currently made. MrDisibility at Heel Toe Automotive needs at least 10 committed people before he can make the molds for these gems. If you are in the market to upgrade your 3G hatch why not be one of the first 10 people in the world to own a beautiful Heel Toe Automotive 3G hatch carbon fiber hood? Tax returns are coming soon.............. Thanks to Screech for renewing the interest.

Here's a link to what they will look like, only for a 3G civic instead of a CRX:
MP Carbon Fiber Hood, 84-87 Civic, US OEM Style
Here's a link to Screech's sign up thread:
Hoods For 3g Hatch. Cf/fg, I'm just curious how many would be interesting if Mr. D were to try

Also if anyone knows of a place that makes light weight fenders for the 3G let me know.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 06 January 2012 - 09:27 PM.

[PuddleSkipper]

Well tried working on the gas pedal yesterday but messed it up, took plenty of pics though. Have to work on it in a week or so when I am able to get another pedal at the junk yard. I did however work on the Electrical Load Detector (ELD).

"This is a photo of the fuse box under the hood (88-91 Civic), near the battery. The red squared in area is what is referred to as the ELD, or Electrical Load Detector, for our car. The ELD is essentially a current transformer that monitors the amount of current draw the car is pulling from the battery. This amount varies from time to time depending on what you have turned on (various electrical devices). The ELD will output .1 - 4.8 volts to the ECU. This reference voltage is what tells the ECU to increase or decrease the field strength in the alternator, which in turn bumps up the output of the alternator." This is important for my build because I am building for mpgs. There are ways of bypassing the ELD, but I suspect the ECU would not be able to reduce the field strength in the alternator, thereby creating more drag on the motor by not being able to adjust with the demand, and less mpgs. Although I am not completely done this is what I started.


There is a cover that the ELD sits in, once removed it looks like this:

Top


Bottom


I took a Dremel and cut the part of the top part of the fuse box that held it in place and also removed any metal I did not need.

Top Left hole I ovaled out with my Dremel to get the ELD to line up with the screws on the 84-87 engine compartment fuse box.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 09 January 2012 - 02:11 AM.

[PuddleSkipper]

Screwed together! And no wiring to cut and splice!

Back side assembled


To get this to fit under the hood the air box had to be move toward the front of the car. I removed a chunk of metal between the hole and the side of the bracket to turn it into a U shaped notch for more adjustment. Did this on all three attaching bolts for the air box.
Stock location..........very little room!

Battery bracket...........

Shock tower bracket..............


Ahhh.................now we have space! Tucked in and the hood is able to close over it.


At this point I am going to use the Dremel to cut the bottom part of the 88-91 civic fuse box to cover the exposed metal on the back side of the ELD and make it more a self contained unit. I am also going to fabricate a bracket to mount it to the shock tower.

Edited by PuddleSkipper, 15 May 2012 - 01:05 PM.